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1

Friday, November 21st 2014, 9:07pm

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

Posts: 45

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Fun Factor.

I have a question for Imperial side, its abroad question any Imp can answer. This game is supposed to be about achieving things, ie (gear, gold, runes, glyphs etc). What makes a game fun to me is the struggle to achieve something. The harder it is to get something the more worthwhile it is to get. For league this is not a problem. But I wonder, how is this struggle for Imps? It seems to me you win +75% of the Skirmishes, collect most amal from MI, win mostly in any PVP scenario, and get all the best gear from Raid Dungeons. It seems to me like it would be boring to be an Imp. Skirmishes are zero challenge, you can walk right into Novo and kill for the most party at will. Seems like making things more even would make the game more fun in my opinion. So feel free to give me you're input on how fun it is to win all the time and get everything.

See you in WH with a bunch of low geared/terrible build lig people as you 3 cap us. BYE...

2

Friday, November 21st 2014, 9:53pm

collect most amal from MI

get all the best gear from Raid Dungeons

what?

3

Saturday, November 22nd 2014, 2:31am

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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I'm not sure about what I wrote that you don't understand. Please clarify.

4

Saturday, November 22nd 2014, 10:19pm

easy wins are great fun
much more fun than hard, neverending battles
winning all and getting everything is fun too

...but thats not reality

imperium does not always win
league is sometimes really annoying in BGs...

5

Saturday, November 22nd 2014, 10:30pm

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Yeah ligs are so annoying on bgs :D
And why lig is better than empire? Here you go :love:
Looking for people which want to play skyforge conctact via private message :rolleyes:

6

Saturday, November 22nd 2014, 11:03pm

just gimme full 13 runes i can lead a new guild against imps ^^


7

Monday, November 24th 2014, 11:50pm

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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easy wins are great fun
much more fun than hard, neverending battles
winning all and getting everything is fun too

...but thats not reality

imperium does not always win
league is sometimes really annoying in BGs...
What times do you go BG's,... im going to start going at that time. . .

8

Tuesday, November 25th 2014, 12:30am

last 3 hours of the day, leauges usually destroy empire in bg

9

Tuesday, November 25th 2014, 2:22am

Mapz

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half my battlegrounds are empire against empire, so still fun. NOT. since it takes 2 hours to get an invite usually.

10

Tuesday, November 25th 2014, 9:28pm

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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last 3 hours of the day, leauges usually destroy empire in bg
LOL so i have a 3 hour window to get some wins in skirmishes... thats awesome.

I haven't had a skirmish win in over 3 days. the most turbid iv gotten is 40xtubid. I absolutely regret 100% clicking Lig instead of Imp when I started playing this game.

Thanks for the reply's people.

11

Wednesday, November 26th 2014, 1:48am

reeah19

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why you'd do skirmishes when u can make 6-12 amal with alchemy quest in same time and without stress... i also stopped for the last 2 weeks, not even a single win even if lig raid was decent, some just have no clue how to play even if they have 55-60k gearscore...
Fireofdeath -70 - demonologist
Puffypuf - 65 - furball warden
Rensy - 65 - paladin
Akyrra - 70 - psionicist healer
Turquiose - 60 - bard
Springfull - 60 - mage
FoxBee - 31 warden

12

Wednesday, November 26th 2014, 2:47pm

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Well maybe it's because when I see imps on battlegrounds at least 4-5 of them are from same guild and probably they use teamspeak that's why they are winning.
From my own expierience when you are even only 2 on ts it's much easier to win bgs.
Looking for people which want to play skyforge conctact via private message :rolleyes:

13

Wednesday, November 26th 2014, 4:00pm

"What makes a game fun to me is the struggle to achieve something. The harder it is to get something the more worthwhile it is to get."

I'd have to take issue with this a little. There's a limit in the work required relative to the reward, beyond which it becomes more like you are working just to work.

There are two aspects to the hardness of getting something (in the context of video games):
* How difficult a single unit of work is.
* How many single units of work are required.

There's a closely linked consideration as well, that of the total elapsed time, which is a function of the second aspect and the number of units of work that can be completed per day (say).

So: why it fails:
* If the total elapsed time is too large, it takes too long to achieve the goal.
* If the total number of single units of work is very large, unless they are freely repeatable and very short in duration, the total elapsed time will be too long.
* If a single short-duration unit of work requires a time-consuming unit of additional work (see below for an example), it might as well be counted as being long in duration.
* If a single unit of work is difficult to execute, even if it is not time-consuming, and large numbers are required, then there is a risk of burnout.

Why might I require a time-consuming unit of additional work in order to complete a single unit of work? Here I'm thinking of the current gearing-up process in Allods, where I must acquire and use an upgrading item (basic unit of work), but using that item requires a significant amount of gold and another item (amalgam) which is acquired by various time-consuming methods or by spending even more gold. Acquiring that gold requires a chunk of additional time.

Given that I have limited time available to play the game, Allods passed the "too much elapsed time" mark when 5.0 was released. In 4.X, I was able to farm upgraders from the free-merc flights, and then sell the junk to pay 60-100 gold per amalgam (in the AH) and 50-80 gold per upgrader used to activate the machine, and still have a bit of gold left over on each flight. Sure, it still took time, but I could do multiple runs per day, and have fun watching the differences in competence of different groups. I did this to crank my astral gear from new-blue all the way to barely-legendary. It took a few months, but the rate of progress was fast enough to be tangible. The 5.0 procedure was just horribly expensive by comparison, in both gold and (consequently) elapsed time.

So no, the result wasn't worth the effort.
Now f2p 60 Xadaganian summy with 60/60/60 tailor/weaponsmith/alchemist, bleah gear, 555/555 runes
Now p2p 28 Xadaganian avenger with 20 weaponsmith
I'm on an extended break from Allods at the moment, but I'm lurking here to keep up with what's happening. From the looks of things in 5.0.02, I'm better off where I am.

14

Wednesday, November 26th 2014, 4:35pm


* If the total elapsed time is too large, it takes too long to achieve the goal.


I'd say "too long to achieve" is relative to how long the achieved benefits stay relevant. For example: Greatness (pre nerf) and Personal Allod take very, very long time to get. But I would not say "too long", because they stay relevant pretty much forever (which is longer than the time required to get them). This is something designed pretty much perfectly.

About gear, you're probably right. The gear stays relevant too short of a time and therefore it is "too long".

15

Wednesday, November 26th 2014, 4:53pm

Kissaki

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16

Friday, November 28th 2014, 5:25am

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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why you'd do skirmishes when u can make 6-12 amal with alchemy quest in same time and without stress... i also stopped for the last 2 weeks, not even a single win even if lig raid was decent, some just have no clue how to play even if they have 55-60k gearscore...
i do this quest also, but its very boring. pvp is much more fun :D . i agree some do not know how to play. I'm at best an average player at this game, but i know enough not to chase a fabled scout out into the open when i can wait for him to come into the close area of the cannon to have a better chance of surviving(like some do)

17

Friday, November 28th 2014, 5:28am

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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Well maybe it's because when I see imps on battlegrounds at least 4-5 of them are from same guild and probably they use teamspeak that's why they are winning.
From my own expierience when you are even only 2 on ts it's much easier to win bgs.

Well maybe it's because when I see imps on battlegrounds at least 4-5 of them are from same guild and probably they use teamspeak that's why they are winning.
From my own expierience when you are even only 2 on ts it's much easier to win bgs.

Well maybe it's because when I see imps on battlegrounds at least 4-5 of them are from same guild and probably they use teamspeak that's why they are winning.
From my own expierience when you are even only 2 on ts it's much easier to win bgs.
I agree 100%. but my question was is the fun for imps to just crush in pvp. isnt the fun in a good equal battle?

18

Friday, November 28th 2014, 5:30am

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

Posts: 45

Location: USA

Occupation: Being a Baller

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"What makes a game fun to me is the struggle to achieve something. The harder it is to get something the more worthwhile it is to get."

I'd have to take issue with this a little. There's a limit in the work required relative to the reward, beyond which it becomes more like you are working just to work.

There are two aspects to the hardness of getting something (in the context of video games):
* How difficult a single unit of work is.
* How many single units of work are required.

There's a closely linked consideration as well, that of the total elapsed time, which is a function of the second aspect and the number of units of work that can be completed per day (say).

So: why it fails:
* If the total elapsed time is too large, it takes too long to achieve the goal.
* If the total number of single units of work is very large, unless they are freely repeatable and very short in duration, the total elapsed time will be too long.
* If a single short-duration unit of work requires a time-consuming unit of additional work (see below for an example), it might as well be counted as being long in duration.
* If a single unit of work is difficult to execute, even if it is not time-consuming, and large numbers are required, then there is a risk of burnout.

Why might I require a time-consuming unit of additional work in order to complete a single unit of work? Here I'm thinking of the current gearing-up process in Allods, where I must acquire and use an upgrading item (basic unit of work), but using that item requires a significant amount of gold and another item (amalgam) which is acquired by various time-consuming methods or by spending even more gold. Acquiring that gold requires a chunk of additional time.

Given that I have limited time available to play the game, Allods passed the "too much elapsed time" mark when 5.0 was released. In 4.X, I was able to farm upgraders from the free-merc flights, and then sell the junk to pay 60-100 gold per amalgam (in the AH) and 50-80 gold per upgrader used to activate the machine, and still have a bit of gold left over on each flight. Sure, it still took time, but I could do multiple runs per day, and have fun watching the differences in competence of different groups. I did this to crank my astral gear from new-blue all the way to barely-legendary. It took a few months, but the rate of progress was fast enough to be tangible. The 5.0 procedure was just horribly expensive by comparison, in both gold and (consequently) elapsed time.

So no, the result wasn't worth the effort.

Thanks for your post, very well thought out. :thumbsup:

19

Friday, November 28th 2014, 5:32am

  • "godlikecharm" started this thread

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I like turtles :(

I like turtles :(

as always kissaki, thank you for your well thought out and insightful comments. keep em commin 8)

20

Friday, November 28th 2014, 2:30pm

Marco

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I have a question for Imperial side, its abroad question any Imp can answer. This game is supposed to be about achieving things, ie (gear, gold, runes, glyphs etc). What makes a game fun to me is the struggle to achieve something. The harder it is to get something the more worthwhile it is to get. For league this is not a problem. But I wonder, how is this struggle for Imps? It seems to me you win +75% of the Skirmishes, collect most amal from MI, win mostly in any PVP scenario, and get all the best gear from Raid Dungeons. It seems to me like it would be boring to be an Imp. Skirmishes are zero challenge, you can walk right into Novo and kill for the most party at will. Seems like making things more even would make the game more fun in my opinion. So feel free to give me you're input on how fun it is to win all the time and get everything.

See you in WH with a bunch of low geared/terrible build lig people as you 3 cap us. BYE...

If you want to have a real challenge .. join pay to play because this is what pay to play means... achieving things without ... well you know...

There is so much to achieve here expect char progress for example making Bgs here open again :thumbsup:

One reason pay to play was created ... buts it was misunderstood by most ppl leaved.

Greetings

Taleron

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Marco" (Nov 28th 2014, 2:40pm)


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